Use of Simple Green and Formula 409 in indirect product contact surfaces

What are people's thoughts on using degreasers such as Formula 409 and Simple Green to clean indirect product contact surfaces such as production scales, walls, ceilings, etc.?  I found documentation that Simple Green is EPA approved and USDA approved for food manufacturing facilities, but it appears that is not the case for Formula 409.

we've been in a number of plants that use simple green with great success.

as to 409, it is not recommended due to certain chemical properties.

Thanks for the input.  That confirms what my thoughts were, especially on the Formula 409.  I had reviewed the SDS and it appears Formula 409 is an EPA registered pesticide.

Simple Green also makes an organic approved version called Crystal simple green---works really well....inexpensive to boot

We moved to Simple Green Crystal also. It works great and to comply with labeling and make it more cost effective, we buy it in 55 gallon barrels and dilute / refill the bottles ourselves. We just buy a case or two of Simple Green spray bottles and refill them until the label becomes illegible. That keeps us from having to generate GHS labels for secondary containers

We moved to Simple Green Crystal also. It works great and to comply with labeling and make it more cost effective, we buy it in 55 gallon barrels and dilute / refill the bottles ourselves. We just buy a case or two of Simple Green spray bottles and refill them until the label becomes illegible. That keeps us from having to generate GHS labels for secondary containers

Does this require any special tracking/recording to ensure the correct ratio is met when you dilute? 

What are people's thoughts on using degreasers such as Formula 409 and Simple Green to clean indirect product contact surfaces such as production scales, walls, ceilings, etc.?  I found documentation that Simple Green is EPA approved and USDA approved for food manufacturing facilities, but it appears that is not the case for Formula 409.

I note the above approvals however I nonetheless find this comment disturbing -

12.     Why aren't the ingredients listed on the label?

Simple Green is non-toxic. Therefore, the listing of ingredients on the label is not required by law. Simple Green's unique formula is protected under the US Trade Secrecy Act and has been extensively tested to verify the product's credentials. Simple Green complies with all current labeling requirements for ingredient disclosure on cleaning products. If you have an allergy, medical reason, or technical reason for wanting to know if Simple Green contains a particular item, please contact us at XXXX and we will help you as best we can.

https://www.motormad...formation_id=13

 

(the specific ingredients (bar fragrance) do in fact appear to be directly available from the manufacturer -

https://simplegreen....afer-choice.php

PS - IMEX scented cleaning products may have restricted applicability in food manufacturing facilities. (Maybe there is a non-scented version).

PPS - I found the relatively high level of Aluminium in the EPA's analysis of Simple Green rather curious -

https://www.epa.gov/...e/simple-greenr

Does this require any special tracking/recording to ensure the correct ratio is met when you dilute? 

Did you ever get an answer how to verify or track the correct ration for dilution for use of Simple Green Crystal Cleaner? We just purchased the product and haven't used it yet, but I am wondering how to test/verify correct dilution for this product.

Did you ever get an answer how to verify or track the correct ration for dilution for use of Simple Green Crystal Cleaner? We just purchased the product and haven't used it yet, but I am wondering how to test/verify correct dilution for this product.

I contacted the company and this is the answer I received. I am sharing their answer in case it would be helpful to anyone else. 

from Sunshine Makers, Inc., the makers of Simple Green cleaning products:

There are a few options on how to verify if Crystal Simple Green is being diluted properly.

1. pH. This is not the most accurate way to measure a dilution, but can work. The starting pH of Crystal Simple Green will range from 10.0  – 11.0. We also manufacture a 1:10 dilution of Crystal Simple Green that has a pH of 8.20 – 9.20. We cannot provide you the pH range of a 1:20 dilution as we do not manufacture that amount. Also our water quality will influence the results slightly compared to your water quality. However, you can make a manual 1:20 dilution, and test the pH value. Then test the pH values of all the other dilutions you create to see if it matches. A pH meter is recommended versus a pH testing strip. Testing stripes tend to not be as accurate. The reason this method is not as accurate as one would like is that the variability of pH gets smaller and smaller the more water that is added. This is to say the difference between a 1:20 and a 1:30 in pH is significantly smaller than the pH difference between undiluted and a 1:10. Given that the crystal simple Green starts off with a small range in it’s pH, you can be in a situation where sometimes a 1:20 pH might be as high as 8.2, which could be the lower end of a 1:10 dilution.
2. Solids. Measuring solids with a refractometer is a more accurate method of measurement. The starting solids of crystal are 4.00- 8.10. While measurements will need to be conducted yourself to account for your water quality, the drop is solids will be consistent with the more water added. Start with testing the solids content of the undiluted Crystal Simple Green. While we can provide this to you with our certificates of analysis for each batch made, you’ll want to account for variability in people, temperature, humidity and equipment. Manually create your 1:20 dilution and get the solids reading again. Repeat this several times for all the different containers of Crystal Simple Green to create a thorough data set to see the drop in solids content from undiluted to the 1:20 dilution. From there, once you know what the solids reading is for the concentrate, you can then test the solids value of the 1:20 dilution.
3. Use a proportioner when making dilution. There are many benefits to type of equipment
   1. Not having to worry about inaccurate dilutions that might occur when diluting manually
   2. You can still verify the accuracy of dilution by pH or solids if you’d like but
   3. When using a proportioner you only need to verify that the equipment is working correctly occasionally, instead of gathering a huge data set for a specific cleaning product. Meaning, a single weekly or monthly verification of the equipment versus weeks or months of data for every cleaning product you might be using in your facility.
   4. Verification of a proportioner can be done with just a single product, and can be done with a product that is easier to account for than Crystal Simple Green.